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Post by delkar on Apr 27, 2006 15:45:50 GMT -5
Alright...i'll change it...though I was under the impression that though I am a character with only two class levels in addition to a +1 LA - essentially a third level character - I would still get the feat for having an effective level of 3.
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Post by DM Cyphus on Apr 27, 2006 15:54:45 GMT -5
I realize this is intended for monsters, but essentially this is for Monster NPC's and PC's alike. We don't get feats nor ability score enhancements until a level after the others. <sigh> But...we get some nice little extras anyhow.
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Post by delkar on Apr 27, 2006 16:01:48 GMT -5
Okay the books always right...just ignore it for now...I'll edit the whole thing once I get to my PC with the books on it along with the diety and the goliath information.
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Post by The Ascendant on Apr 27, 2006 16:03:07 GMT -5
I believe that if you read in the FR campaign setting guide it lists that 3ECL characters are 3rd level characters in terms of bonus feats and stat increases...I would go with it.
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Post by delkar on Apr 27, 2006 16:04:20 GMT -5
With which?
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Post by DM Cyphus on Apr 27, 2006 16:56:12 GMT -5
Actually, FR says the same: [/sup][/i] Because characters of these powerful races possess a higher level than just their character level alone, they do not gain levels as fast as a normal character. Add your character's level adjustment to your character level to arrive at your effective character level (ECL). From now on, this character uses his ECL to determine how many experience points he needs to reach a new level. These characters begin play with the minimum number of experience points needed to be a normal character of their ECL. You still use the character's actual level for everything else (such as when you acquire feats, skill point acquisition, and so on).[/quote] I was lookin' for 3.5 references initially. But it seems to be that way across the board, unfortunately. When you look at the stat bonuses we get though and the little "special things" attached to the races, it balances out in the end. It may feel like we progress horribly slow, but those little things generally give us an edge. Particularly the Goliaths. lol That larger weapon usage is incredible...not to mention the Strength and Con bonus. Anywho...now I sound like a Rules Lawyer.
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Post by delkar on Apr 27, 2006 17:09:36 GMT -5
I'm confused now...which way do I do it?
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Post by DM Cyphus on Apr 27, 2006 17:17:08 GMT -5
That's up to Josh, really. The only reason I point it out and go all "Rules Lawyer" is because Josh indicated that he'd like this to possibly be published. For that reason, I thought it might be a good idea to run it against characters that are "by the book," so to speak. If he wants to go house rule on this one, I'm all for it! lol Only makes me a bigger badass capable of all the Druidess, Sorceress, Goliath ass-whoopinness known to man. j/k I'm the nice guy who likes to heal his friends.
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Post by The Ascendant on Apr 27, 2006 18:43:26 GMT -5
oh snap...I misread that for sure...the thing that sucks is that some of the 2-3 LA creatures that have a HD adjustment also get feats up the ass...centaurs for example or werefolk... damn!! They get skills ranks, attack bonuses, feats, stats, and saves for very cheap LA and there are a host of critters who get that... look at Bugbear if you want to giggle at cheap ass shit... those fools get some ridiculous bonuses for just 1 LA.
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Post by willfire on Apr 27, 2006 22:44:19 GMT -5
Bugbear warrior and owlbear monk.
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Post by DM Cyphus on Apr 28, 2006 7:42:13 GMT -5
Wow....lol...were you to start as a level 2 character...Bugbear really is a nice class. You get the hit to Charisma like Dwarves and the bonus to Con, but also a bonus to Dex and +4 to Strength. Sheesh. Darkvision... However...the feat thing is actually just accurate. Because, honestly, it's Hit Dice that feat progression is based off of, not truly character level. So...where a Bugbear starts with three hit dice, he gets two feats (1 at 1st Level/HD and 1 at 3rd Level/HD). He wouldn't get his next feat until he had attained three character levels, which works out to a normal feat progression...but also means he wouldn't get a feat at 1st level for his character class. Aside from that though...the Racial Skills, the HD (for that extra HP...a big worry for most LA characters)...Natural Armor...they'd make hella good combat-based classes...and even as Divine casters or Wizards they aren't any worse off than the standard PHB races...with nice physical stats guaranteed. But anyway...I digress as usual. Yeah...the Bugbears get a little much for a +1 LA. Wish I got some Racial Hit Dice. BTW...was there any change in the Gray Orc racial description from Races of Faerun to Unapproachable East? I only used RoF, haven't had the opportunity to read through UE.
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Post by jamondashwood on Apr 28, 2006 8:08:17 GMT -5
Okay.... if you're looking for LA characters you CAN NOT BEAT the Stone Giant!!!!
LA+4 but for that you get:
-+16 Str, +4 Dex, +8 Con, +2 Wis and no minuses! -Large Size, this can be a double edged sword though -bonus to reach and speed: 10' reach 40' speed -Darkvision -14d8 HP!!!, BAB +10, and base saving throws of Fort +9, Ref +4, and Will +4 -17X(2+Int Bonus) for skills -5 feats!!!! -+11 Natural AC and the ability to throw and catch large boulders.
Now that just KICKS ASS!
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Post by DM Cyphus on Apr 28, 2006 9:41:54 GMT -5
Damn...that's gotta be broken. I wonder if it'd be possible to make a 5th level character capable of taking that sucker down with its 1 level of character class. lol That's how you figure out the balance...
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Post by The Ascendant on Apr 28, 2006 15:36:51 GMT -5
IMO, that is the broken thing with LA; its very arbitrary. Bugears are ridiculous for example. Look in Races of Faerun at the were creatures, which are insanely broken (A werebear is only a 2 LA with a rugged ass amount of advantages and only silver as a disadvantage). Either way, how is everyone progressing with characters?
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Post by willfire on Apr 28, 2006 16:05:47 GMT -5
Well, see, there's quirks to all this. A stone giant? You're huge, buddy. NOTICABLE. Forget about ever sneaking up on anyone again, even when when invisible. Thud thud thud, oh hey it's a stone giant trying to sneak up on us, fire in that direction, oh shitzle you're large size, you got hit. Get in trouble, and there's no where to hide except the highest mountains. Werewolf. Damn easy to kill. How? Stick a silver coin in a raw steak. Dead doggie. As a character, yer an effin' lycanthrope. Good luck having romantic night on the full moon. And if anybody finds out? Werewolf hunters out the furry arse!! Bugbear. OH COME ON. Like anybody likes one of them tromping through their village, decked out in armor and gear! There'll be screams for the local wizard before you reach the tavern. *snrk* I think that's enough ranting from me. I think I'm done with Tammy, so when're we gonna start?
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